167. Liz Clarke 

Welcome to Unleashed at Work and Home. I'm Colleen Pelar, and this is where pet professionals come for honest conversations about what it really takes to show up for yourself while serving the animals you love. If you've ever felt caught between compassion and exhaustion, you're in the right place. Here we explore what it means to reconnect with your inner wisdom and rediscover the joy that brought you to this work. Make sure to join my email community at ColleenPelar.com for gentle practical insights designed specifically for pet professionals. Now let's dive in. Welcome back to Unleashed at Work and Home. My guest today is Liz Clarke [NOTE: Otter.ai renders guest surname as "Clark" at one point — transcript uses "Clarke" throughout per the speaker label], and she is the founder of Kathleen's Paws. Welcome, Liz. Welcome. I don't know why I'm saying welcome. Thank you for having me. Tell us a little bit about Kathleen's Paws. What's Kathleen's Paws, and what do you do with Kathleen's Paws?

LIZ CLARKE  1:02

So Kathleen's Paws — she's fairly new. I spent some time in Bulgaria, and I rescued her. She was dumped in the village, her and her brother. We were supposed to rehome her, but she got Parvo. Her brother, unfortunately, passed away. So I obviously kept her after that, nursed her through it, because in Bulgaria, the vets aren't around the corner — it's 10 miles away. So I originally took her to the vet, he set her up with a drip, IV fluids, so I would — I do have a nursing background, so I was on my own, literally in the village with her, nursing her through it. The vet had rung up and everything, and she got through it, and if we hadn't found her, it could have been a completely different story. Who knows what would have happened to her? So I thought, there are lots of stray animals in Bulgaria, and I couldn't ignore it anymore. But what can I do to try and help, even though I'm not there full time, and all the posts on Facebook — "stray animal, what do I do?" I thought — and we have such — just obviously, I nursed her through this. She was a tiny little baby, and we've got such a bond. She's sat here right next to me at the moment. We've got such a bond. She needed a legacy. She needs to be the example of how life can be for street dogs. So that's where that came from. So I've set up a Bulgarian Facebook group, and we support all the different rescuers in Bulgaria, because it's not an easy job. We support all expats, because they want to help, as well as the big expat community in Bulgaria, who again have no idea where to start, and it's just a roller coaster from now. I'm doing so much training, because it's just something I'm so passionate about.

COLLEEN  2:42

So, were you in Bulgaria on vacation when you came across Kathleen, or — like, how did it happen that this dog came your way and then changed everything?

LIZ CLARKE  2:54

So it was at a tough point in life. My friend already had a house over there, she said, "Well, just come over for a break, a reset — just for a week." So I thought, yeah, I really need this. I'd never been to Bulgaria, never really heard of Bulgaria. It's in Eastern Europe — that's all I knew. I'd never been to that side of the world before. So she has a house out there, and I will never — it's about two and a half hours drive from the airport to this strange country. I was mesmerized because you're driving through the mountains, it's peaceful, it's quiet, and as soon as we got to a village, I stepped out of the car. Just this instant rush of peace came over me — I'm home. It just felt like something I'd always — I've always loved nature. I'm a country girl, I'm not a city girl. I can't stand the hustle and bustle — mostly in England it's hustle and bustle all over, unless you're very rich and you can live in the countryside — but in Bulgaria, that peace, it just waved all over me. So that week's vacation ended up being three months. Oh wow, because the visa situation — you're allowed to stay there 90 days, and you have to leave for 90 days, and then you can go back. So I did that for a bit, and I think it was on my third or fourth visit that she was dumped in the village. There'd been a lot of dumpings — we rescue, rehome, and sometimes just make sure they're supported in the village — but somehow, and I wasn't looking for another dog — not that you ever are — it just happened, and she just happened, and we've just got this incredible bond. She's now here in England with me. So when I used to do my 90 days there, 90 days out, I used to leave her with friends, but it was so hard leaving her, so I thought I'm going to bring her to England. She's taken some time to readjust because of the noise — she doesn't have the freedom she had there — but we're together.

SPEAKER 1  4:52

Awesome. So that's so interesting that it just should have happened — [unclear — possible audio drop]

COLLEEN  5:00

And now it changed the trajectory. So you go back and forth between England and Bulgaria?

SPEAKER 1  5:07

[unclear]

LIZ CLARKE  5:07

I do a lot online — like the rescuers over there, they're in it day in, day out. They don't have time for social media, they don't have time to research, they don't have time for themselves. So I try and support them however I can — I can research things, I can give them guidance, I can give them support, because I'm not on the front line when I'm not there. I know that when I am there, I can't do any of this. That's why I think that's another reason why things don't really change over there, because they're too busy on the ground — they can't do the campaigning, they can't do the advocating. When I'm over here, because I know that when I've been there I can't do any of that — because trying to help all the animals, you don't have the time, all the headspace for it. So I try and support them from here. In answer to your question, I don't go over as much as I'd like to, because I've got elderly animals in England. I am going over next week, just for a week, but I've got elderly animals in England who need me as well. So it's really hard on my heart because I want to be over there, but obviously I want to support my elderly animals in England.

COLLEEN  6:08

I think we can all relate to that — like having a heart in more than one place, and the need to balance what we do and how we do it, and it's tricky. It's tricky.

LIZ CLARKE  6:18

Yeah, it really is, because I am in a different space when I'm in England than when I am in Bulgaria — I just feel so much at peace.

COLLEEN  6:26

I love that statement about — like, you just got out of the car and you could feel at home.

LIZ CLARKE  6:32

I'll never, ever forget that feeling. Ever. I really just — because it's kind of, you know, when you imagine where you'd love to live, and what your ideal day is, and where you'd love to be — something like that I'd always dreamt of, and I never knew it existed, and just that moment stepping out of the car — I knew this was home. This is home.

COLLEEN  6:51

I think it's also an interesting commentary on our nervous systems and our bodies, and how our bodies know things to be true. And sometimes our brains are very busy analyzing things, but your body knew something and sent a huge signal to you in that moment — I'm home.

LIZ CLARKE  7:11

I'll never forget that feeling ever, and I went with it as well. I didn't just ignore that feeling. I didn't stay for the week and then go home and go back. I stayed with it, and I'm slowly building a life out there, between life in England. The goal is permanently one day.

COLLEEN  7:29

Is it? That's awesome. That's so cool. Well, a question I love to ask all my guests is: what did you think you were going to be when you grew up, when you were 10 years old? And now I'm super curious, since you so very much fell into this. So 10-year-old Liz — what did she think? Yeah, oh, she knew — so it was animals?

LIZ CLARKE  7:51

Just started doing this — in the past I've had a wide range of careers, and they weren't to do with animals, which really bewilders me. But it's all — speaking to my — I remember my mum used to say I always wanted to be a vet, but I never got the qualifications at school — like the maths and the science. I was very good at English and things like that. But always been animals. Always.

COLLEEN  8:16

Can you take me through the trajectory of other jobs that were not the right ones for you?

LIZ CLARKE  8:21

Looking back — because I used to suffer a lot with regret, like, why did I not do this sooner? But then analyzing, speaking to people, I think because of the skills I picked up over the years, they've allowed me into this space now. Everything for a reason. So rather than going with regret, this is how I've soothed myself and come to terms with it, if you will. So, yeah. Then I thought, "Vet nurse," and because I said to my mum, she said, "Well, you researched that there wasn't enough money in it." So I went into people's nursing. Like, why would I do that? So I went into people's nursing and got pregnant with my son. They offered me six weeks maternity leave. I was 20 years of age. I was like, I can't — at 20 years old, I can't leave my son for six weeks. So I gave up the nursing at university, and I went to work in a doctor's surgery, and I did a degree in health and social care there. So it's a level before qualified nurse. I worked my way up there — in a GP surgery, taking bloods, doing lots of medical things — and I was there for 10 years. And then I went to work in the police. No — okay — I wasn't fit enough for the fitness test. So all my careers that I wanted to do didn't quite — like a nurse, but the bit below nursing; the police — the fitness didn't pass. I passed all the strength things, the written work, but the physical — I don't know if you've heard of them over there — the bleep test. It was horrid. Oh, it was horrendous. I nearly died. You have to run between two spots as fast as you can, and you're on a timer. I couldn't do that. So I ended up working as a witness care officer. So people who have to go to court — they've been through horrific crimes. I supported those people, helping them with provisions — like they have to face their attacker and things like that. But that was really interesting — gave me lots of resilience skills, talking skills, compassion. So again, I've learned lots of skills from that.

COLLEEN  10:33

Yeah, yeah, huge overlap in that job and the things you're doing now.

LIZ CLARKE  10:40

And then so I did that for five years, and then my son had some issues, so I had to stay at home and support him, and then I went into life coaching, working for a celebrity — totally normal trajectory, that was great. So I did that for eight years. You have the Real Housewives in America — this was with the Real Housewives of Cheshire. So our English one — one of the stars from there. Tanya Barsley [spelling uncertain — please verify], where I know — so I got to go to all the red carpet events. It just seems like a different lifetime ago.

COLLEEN  11:17

Yeah, it does. It does not feel like animal welfare at all.

LIZ CLARKE  11:21

But they were always there in my mind. I had the animals at home. I remember once I rescued a chicken and Tanya [name uncertain — please verify] was just like, "What have you done?" And she had a boutique, a wellness boutique, and I was always trying to bring the dogs in off the street. She was like, "Stop turning my boutique into a farm, you know." Always. But I think all the skills I've learned from those careers have given me — so I did eight years there, and travel has always been a passion of mine, and then I did five years as a travel agent. I know. Okay — nobody can see this — but she's shaking her head thinking, what?

COLLEEN  12:06

I just think it's so cool, but I don't — I don't see how one leaps from being a witness carer to being the person supporting a celebrity to being a travel agent. Like...

LIZ CLARKE  12:21

Being quite — what's the word — impulsive, and always wanting to follow my dreams. Like all the things I've done — I love traveling, I love helping people, and also the animals, so that was — and I love, like, the medical side as well, and I've done all those, yeah. And everything I've learned along the way, I think, has led me to where I am now.

COLLEEN  12:43

For sure. I can absolutely see benefits in each of these, in terms of your advocacy — both on behalf of the animals and the people rescuing and supporting the animals in Bulgaria — you've got some lovely layered skills. And having been associated with the star gives you, like, a sense of — I don't know — fundraising, networking, some of those pieces. You probably have a view of that world as well, from a different angle.

LIZ CLARKE  13:13

I still — I lived in Kuwait as a child, so I think that's where the traveling bug came from as well. That was a wonderful life as well, so travel has always meant meeting different animals all over the world.

COLLEEN  13:27

Do you have a favorite animal?

LIZ CLARKE  13:29

I love them all, but I think dogs, at the moment — they're my — it used to be cats. I grew up with cats, but I've got a soft spot for dogs. But honestly, all animals — I know my absolute nightmare. I was helping my friend in Bulgaria clear a garden, and it was full of snails. I didn't do much clearing, because I was spending the whole time moving these snails. Yeah, I was useless. Moving the snails. So all animals, all animals.

COLLEEN  13:59

So interesting. And Kathleen's Paws focuses specifically on dogs, or dogs and cats?

LIZ CLARKE  14:08

Yeah, and cats. No, absolutely, we won't discriminate — the street cats, and the plight [note: source audio unclear around "what's the strip" — "plight" appears to be the intended word] of street dogs and street cats. And in Bulgaria, of horses and donkeys as well, who are also mistreated a lot. So wide net, but it is mainly the dogs, and that's where I'm doing most of my training at the moment — the dogs.

COLLEEN  14:39

That's awesome, and hooray. Thank you. Like, you need — and then your gift for impulsivity allowed you to just take action, big action. Because sustained action, moving in a direction, building something — that's so cool.

LIZ CLARKE  14:58

It sounds — speaking it out loud — if someone was telling me this story, I'd be like, "You are crazy."

COLLEEN  15:05

I love it. I love it. And I absolutely think lives make sense looking backwards, but there's just no way that 10-year-old could have predicted all the things that were headed her way. She had no way to know.

LIZ CLARKE  15:20

No.

COLLEEN  15:20

Just as you have no way to know now what the next 10 years will bring.

LIZ CLARKE  15:28

Yeah. I think I started this because I had a tricky time — I found Bulgaria, and I was loving the travel. I was going to all different countries, meeting lots of street animals, which wasn't the purpose of my trips, but I met the street animals.

COLLEEN  15:45

Imagine that — the woman who had to move all the slugs happened to notice and meet street animals. I'm shocked.

LIZ CLARKE  15:51

The amount of time — because we'd — like, on work trips, not that we had to, but we were offered to go on work trips just to experience the countries and the hotels and things, and I was always the one they'd be like, "Where's Liz?" — feeding the cats, feeding the dogs. Got a bit of a reputation. I enjoyed the travel, but then it was a time of reflection — I was thinking, right, I've got 20-odd years before I retire, I need to follow this passion with the animals. So doing the work in Bulgaria just seemed natural. Right, I need to do this.

COLLEEN  16:30

So I ask all of my guests to share some words that matter to them, and the words you shared with me are "whatever it takes," and you put a note in there that said you also have it as a tattoo, which I totally love. So — look at that — "whatever it takes," right there on your forearm.

LIZ CLARKE  16:49

Always see it. "Whatever it takes." Just never give up, keep going.

COLLEEN  16:53

So, what inspired that to become the tattoo, to become the motto, to become the way you live?

LIZ CLARKE  17:01

I think I've always struggled with my mood, and like, sometimes in the stage of giving up — and that would do nobody any good. I've got children, I've got the animals, I've got too much to give. So it just reminds me: whatever it takes, just keep going. People need you, the animals need you. Never give up. So I thought, rather than "never give up" — which could mean just getting up in the morning, which could mean campaigning for the animals, which could mean just anything — "whatever it takes, keep going." So that's why I chose that.

COLLEEN  17:47

Yeah, it definitely has an activating sense to it — it connects you to the passion and the purpose behind something. There's a mission, and I'm going to do whatever it takes to fulfill this. You just mentioned children, and you had mentioned before your son. Do you have more than one?

LIZ CLARKE  18:06

Two boys, yeah. I was — well, when I got pregnant with my oldest son, we got married, so we were married for 10 years, and then we got divorced, so I single-handedly raised them for the past 15 — 16 years now. They're now 25 and 22. So navigating that journey.

COLLEEN  18:31

Interesting experience, isn't it?

LIZ CLARKE  18:33

"Interesting" is an interesting word. Yes.

COLLEEN  18:35

Yeah, I found raising children to be quite an interesting experience. Continues to be, even as they are—

LIZ CLARKE  18:45

Yeah.

COLLEEN  18:45

Full adults. And also there's still moments where you're like, oh wait, that's my kid that that's happening to — oh wait.

LIZ CLARKE  18:54

I know, because they're always your babies. People say, "Oh, it gets easier as they get older." No, it just gets different. It's different.

COLLEEN  19:04

It's different. Yeah. I think I've mentioned this before on my podcast, but my grandmother — my father's mother — was once asked, "What's the hardest stage of parenting?" And she said, "Oh, I don't know — I think maybe the 30s and 40s." And the person thought that she meant the decade, the 1930s and 1940s. And she was like, "No, no, no — when your children are in their 30s and 40s." Because when they're younger than that, there's usually something you can do that will help — it doesn't fix the thing, but you can help. But in the 30s and 40s, it's a divorce or a mortgage payment, and—

LIZ CLARKE  19:43

Yeah.

COLLEEN  19:44

When you're the parent, you don't stop caring, even though you're like, "Yes, you're an adult, and hooray, you go out, live your life." Oh no. Oh dear. I'm worried about that.

LIZ CLARKE  19:56

It doesn't switch off. So it's not like when they — so you think it switches off, off you go. It doesn't matter how old they are — it's always there.

COLLEEN  20:05

Yeah, it's always there. And it's different. Every stage has its hard parts and its beauties. I agree that I don't think it gets easier, it gets different. It does get physically a lot easier — like when they can definitely do their own shoes and their own seat belts. I was like, "Hallelujah!" [Note: source audio unclear — Otter renders "Frieda" but context suggests an expression of relief. Please verify.]

LIZ CLARKE  20:29

Yeah.

COLLEEN  20:29

And my grandchildren are in the stage right now of the shoes, the seat belts, the helping them get dressed, all of that. And sometimes you're just like, wow.

LIZ CLARKE  20:38

Absolutely.

LIZ CLARKE  20:44

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I know.

COLLEEN  20:49

But they're cute.

LIZ CLARKE  20:56

We all do. We all do.

COLLEEN  20:58

We all do, for sure.

COLLEEN  21:00

For sure. And "whatever it takes" — like, we pick what we're passionate about, and we lean in, and there will be challenging moments in everything, always.

COLLEEN  21:10

What's something that you've learned about yourself or the world through your willingness to dive in and say "whatever it takes"? What's something that you've learned about yourself or the world as a result of that?

LIZ CLARKE  21:31

I'm stronger than I thought I was. I'm more resilient and adaptable. I'm very willing to learn. I think — learn from the mistakes and move on. Again with the guilt I had — the regret, not guilt — that I didn't do this sooner. Reframing it: everything I've done before has led up to this, and I am stronger than I thought I was. And the world can be a very, very sad place.

LIZ CLARKE  22:05

And I want to do all I can to help the animals and the people who take care of them. I know I'm only one person, but it's just something I'm so passionate about, because there are millions and millions of people all over this world fighting every single day to just make lives that little bit better. My God, they deserve everything.

COLLEEN  22:31

I think that's really beautiful. And I caught the part there about noticing the guilt and reframing it to regret — and that is such a helpful tool.

COLLEEN  22:46

For people to recognize that regret has some powerful lessons to teach us, but we don't necessarily have to feel guilty or atone for things — we can say, like, "Oh, if only I could have known then what I know now." And that is how we learn things. So tell us a little bit about that — about how you've noticed regret, and what it has offered you.

LIZ CLARKE  23:05

[Note: attribution uncertain — Otter assigns one brief line to "Liz Clarke 23:05" but text at 23:12 resumes clearly as Liz.] I think it also stems back to my nursing career. When I first started, I used to work in nursing homes, and I'd spend a lot of time talking with the elderly people — how much joy they had, and how they said, "Just don't regret anything." So that's always stuck with me. So anytime I slip into that "why have I not done this sooner?" it brings me back to: I'm here now, because I've got all the tools behind me to do this to the best of my abilities. And without all those experiences, those life challenges have shaped me to be in the right time and the right space now. And don't regret anything, because life's too short.

COLLEEN  23:52

Yeah.

LIZ CLARKE  23:53

And spending all that time with the elderly people coming to the end — that was powerful as well.

COLLEEN  24:00

Yeah. There are so many brilliant lessons that—

LIZ CLARKE  24:06

At the end thinking, you know, with regrets—

COLLEEN  24:09

And people are more likely to regret the things they did not do than the things they did, which is—

LIZ CLARKE  24:19

I think I use that to my advantage to get me out of some tricky situations. See, I'll have no regrets, because I did it — and probably shouldn't have done it, but I live by that thing.

COLLEEN  24:30

I think it's a really interesting insight, because I am a person who holds back less now than I did before, because I was always really super cautious.

LIZ CLARKE  24:44

And it's got me into probably some tricky situations over the years. I'm very — oh my, honestly, perimenopause brain has got all my words all muddled — reckless, impulsive—

COLLEEN  24:59

Inspired. Weird. Energized. Motivated.

LIZ CLARKE  25:02

— cautious. I need to be the middle ground.

COLLEEN  25:08

And you know what, there isn't a right spot for any of us to be in consistently. Like, we all kind of need to learn — what's our natural way of being, and when do we need a little bit more of our natural way, and when do we need to step out of that a little bit — and develop the skills and the fluency to know how to support ourselves, whichever way we're going.

LIZ CLARKE  25:29

Yeah.

COLLEEN  25:30

But it's tricky to not have opinions about how we should have been or what we should have done, those kinds of pieces — and so to sort of look at it like, well, that's how it was, that's how it needed to be in order for me to be in another spot now.

LIZ CLARKE  25:49

Yes. Yeah, I take a lot of comfort in that.

COLLEEN  25:52

Yeah. So you did say — and getting ready to ask a question that feels like it's narrowing, and I want to ask it, but I want to be so clear that I'm not trying to narrow the vision — you said, like, you know you're one person, and you're going to make the difference you can make. So draw me a picture of Kathleen's Paws when you've made an impact. Obviously, other people will get involved — but if you can be as much and as big as you'd like it to be, but you're not going to magically eradicate all street animals from Bulgaria. So what is going to be the thing that tells you, "I'm doing it, this is it"?

LIZ CLARKE  26:39

My main goals for Bulgaria and the world — with my little bubble brain [laughs] — every town, every municipality has a proper humane neutering program, and people are educated on the benefits of that. People take care of their animals, and animal welfare is taught in schools to the next generation. Those are my three visions.

COLLEEN  27:05

Yeah, well, and they fit together so beautifully. Because when animal welfare is taught in schools—

LIZ CLARKE  27:10

Yeah, it should be.

COLLEEN  27:11

The other two pieces will be easier, because people who are taught young how to interact with and care for animals will do better than people who aren't, and they will better understand the population concerns.

LIZ CLARKE  27:25

If all this is in place, it will then trickle down to those rescuers. They won't be so burnt out and in demand. I just wish officials and people high up would just tackle this. It will make a difference to rescuers, the animals, communities — there wouldn't be the need to pay money for shelters and staff, because it would be contained and controlled. And I think about that every day. Why is this not being done?

COLLEEN  27:55

And it is being done on a small scale by Liz Clarke, as she is pushing it forward, and it's important, and it matters.

LIZ CLARKE  28:09

Yeah, trying very much — trying. Yeah, to the animals, and to the people who are taking care of them. And it trickles down to people who have no affection [note: Otter renders "inflection" — context suggests "affection" is intended] for animals.

COLLEEN  28:22

Yeah, who—

LIZ CLARKE  28:23

Live in areas where there are these street dogs. And if it's properly controlled, they'll feel happier. It's just going to have such a massive impact. So that's the vision, that's the goal.

LIZ CLARKE  28:37

Whatever it takes — exactly. I've got odd years [unclear — possibly "20-odd years"] well, this will carry on until probably the very end. I've started it now, and I won't finish.

COLLEEN  28:47

So, Kathleen — some dogs have people names and some dogs have dog kind of names, and I'm curious — what inspired Kathleen to be the right name for this particular dog?

LIZ CLARKE  29:01

So when she was first rescued, it was my neighbors who lived in the village who first found her, and they had to go back to England. So I said I'll take her. They named her Kaya, which is a lovely name. So let me tell you my animals' names, and then you'll see where I had to go with Kathleen. So I've got George, I've got Bruce, I've got Harry, Keith, Richard. I've got a Fred. So — do you see where Kathleen came from? I've had a Mavis.

LIZ CLARKE  29:30

They're all people-y names. So obviously — people names, you know.

COLLEEN  29:33

Is Kaya not a people-y name, or just not an English people-y name?

LIZ CLARKE  29:38

It just didn't fit my vibe, did it? Yeah.

COLLEEN  29:43

So Kathleen it is.

LIZ CLARKE  29:46

Kathleen it is. And she knows it. She knows it.

COLLEEN  29:50

I have not met a dog named Kathleen. I've met many Georges, you know.

LIZ CLARKE  29:55

Yeah.

COLLEEN  29:55

Isn't it interesting? It's fascinating to me. Some dogs have human names. My husband's name is Jack, and I have met so many Jacks — so many dogs named Jack.

LIZ CLARKE  30:06

Have you ever called Keith?

COLLEEN  30:08

No, I have not met a Keith.

LIZ CLARKE  30:10

Yeah, no — yeah, we've got a Keith and a Richard. Yeah, so do you see where Kathleen kind of fits?

LIZ CLARKE  30:21

And they don't care what they're called.

COLLEEN  30:24

As long as it's with love. And I mean, human names are — we choose these names for people we love, so why not choose them for — yeah, we don't have any objection to that. It's just, I have not met a Kathleen. What about this dog inspired Kathleen?

LIZ CLARKE  30:42

Kathleen. Yes, it just kind of works for us as well.

LIZ CLARKE  30:48

Her Bulgarian name is Catalina, so she sometimes gets called Catalina. That's her Bulgarian name, because she's a Bulgarian girl.

COLLEEN  30:56

She is.

LIZ CLARKE  30:57

And she knows both names.

LIZ CLARKE  31:00

Yeah, she's a perfect girl.

COLLEEN  31:02

So, if I had a magic wand and you could grant a wish or a blessing for all of the people who are supporting animals in this world, what would you give us?

LIZ CLARKE  31:14

Peace and permission to take time for you, because you are so worth it, and you so deserve it.

COLLEEN  31:24

Yeah.

LIZ CLARKE  31:26

I know, I know, it's so, so hard. It really, really is. But they're worth it. And staying in the — like, it's physical, it's emotional, it's everything in this work. And they need to — they need to have that — take that care for themselves, because it's unsustainable. The animals need them, and they — to carry on with what their goal and their mission is, just a little, a little bit of time. And it's not selfish.

COLLEEN  32:04

No. Have you always known that, or is that something that you had to learn along the way?

LIZ CLARKE  32:11

Yeah, yeah. I've always helped animals, but working in Bulgaria, and just seeing it day in and day out, and how it was affecting me emotionally and physically — I needed a way of allowing myself to continue doing this without crumbling.

COLLEEN  32:34

Well, I'm so glad you found it, because you had to find "whatever it takes," and whatever it took was actually taking time off and taking care of you.

COLLEEN  32:48

And that is not contradictory.

LIZ CLARKE  32:50

And getting comfortable with doing that.

COLLEEN  32:52

Yes.

LIZ CLARKE  32:53

Because I'm not going to lie, it's not easy at first.

COLLEEN  32:56

It's not easy.

LIZ CLARKE  32:56

Because you say, "Oh my gosh, I could be doing this instead, I could be doing that instead." But this is just as important as all the other things.

COLLEEN  33:06

Yeah, we just wrap that up into the wish that you sent, so that when people feel that permission to take time for themselves, they can also feel that this is just as important as all the others. It really is.

LIZ CLARKE  33:24

It really is.

COLLEEN  33:25

And that's hard for people to step into. It takes practice.

COLLEEN  33:32

At least for me, it was not a pivot point, you know. It's still a learning thing — like, what am I allowed to do, what am I not allowed to do, within those little rules inside my head that I don't even know where they showed up from. But they're all just like the patterns that we grew up with, and the ways of belonging we learned, and all of these things.

LIZ CLARKE  33:51

Exactly.

COLLEEN  33:51

And when we get a little bit more curious about — like, according to who, according to what, whose rule is this that I'm so busy judging myself against — and recognizing that—

LIZ CLARKE  34:05

It's society. Go, go, go — don't stop, just keep going.

COLLEEN  34:08

Yeah.

LIZ CLARKE  34:09

But in this way, you need to take some time. You have to.

COLLEEN  34:11

Yeah, I agree.

LIZ CLARKE  34:13

And the support out there is very, very limited. Like the support for police and other people in the emergency frontline services — which animal rescue and welfare should be recognized as a frontline service.

COLLEEN  34:26

It should. I'm not aware of any communities in which it's considered to be.

LIZ CLARKE  34:32

Yeah, no. And it really should be.

COLLEEN  34:35

It really should.

LIZ CLARKE  34:36

Because what they have to face, what they have to deal with — with police, doctors, the frontline, they're given the proper training and the support systems to keep them in this career, in this profession. And most animal rescuers just get into it by accident, they learn along the way, and those support skills come last. Don't you know your main goal? How can I take care of these animals? How do I keep the money coming in? How do I keep food on the table? Support — it's not there.

LIZ CLARKE  35:09

You don't — it's not on the list of things I need to learn. It really should be.

COLLEEN  35:14

It really should be. And it will be now, because you're granting us this, and now we're all going to absorb it.

COLLEEN  35:24

And it will have ripples. It will have ripples.

LIZ CLARKE  35:27

Yeah, I really hope so.

COLLEEN  35:29

Yeah, well, I think — it's there are people everywhere building things that matter, and what you're doing is building something that matters that did not exist before, and it does now.

LIZ CLARKE  35:44

And for the people — because obviously with my background it kind of is into being there for the people and the animals. Yeah, because for a long time I've thought, "I hate people, don't want to work with people, I'd rather work with animals." But that just doesn't work, because it's the people who are helping the animals that we need.

COLLEEN  36:01

Yeah.

LIZ CLARKE  36:02

So I've made my peace with people. And there are some really, really incredible people — especially in this — not "line of work," in this community of animal people who care. There's some incredible people.

COLLEEN  36:18

There are some incredible people. And there are some incredible people who can come off a little bit brittle or—

LIZ CLARKE  36:25

Understandable, but yes.

COLLEEN  36:27

Absolutely. Like, that piece is there too — our first impression of someone might be like, "Oh, not a fan," and then as we get in a little closer and we learn more, we realize, "Oh, that's actually all just depletion." That is someone who hasn't had the ability to take the time off and care for themselves and do what they needed to do. And when we see the actual person underneath, we can see their struggle there too, and have such compassion for them.

LIZ CLARKE  37:06

And trying to reach those people, because they are just so focused on the animals.

LIZ CLARKE  37:14

Not being — I know, I know. Why are they not flooding in to see me? But no, I totally get it. They're just — they've probably never been asked about them, have they?

COLLEEN  37:27

Yeah. One of my favorite questions to ask people is, "What would you like?" It is a stumper. People can answer what they want for someone else — like, "I want this for this animal, or this person" — but like, no, no, really, what would you like?

COLLEEN  37:45

And it stops people in their tracks, because they've always been looking at the list of available options and choosing the least intrusive of those. But who made that list? Like, what would you like — and it's a mind-stretching activity. Stop and say, "Well, what would I like?" And then to get kind of clear about what that is. And then when you do, then you might have to get a tattoo that says "whatever it takes," because you suddenly see the beauty of what you would like. And it's very rarely not good for everyone around you as well. You know, there's this fear that it's selfish, but when you really talk to people about what they want, what they want—

COLLEEN  38:36

Is beautiful and generative.

LIZ CLARKE  38:38

Yeah.

COLLEEN  38:39

It's really lovely, what they truly want.

LIZ CLARKE  38:43

Getting them to reach that space inside them, isn't it?

COLLEEN  38:46

Yeah, yeah.

LIZ CLARKE  38:47

Peeling up all the dog poop and the bills, and just for them.

COLLEEN  38:52

Yeah, yeah. Well, this has been a fun conversation. If people wanted to learn more about you and your work, Liz, how could they do that?

LIZ CLARKE  39:01

Oh, I'm everywhere. Facebook, Instagram, TikTok. That takes so much time, trying to reach the right people. And — are we on Substack? Have you ever been on that? It's so fascinating.

COLLEEN  39:16

I've read some.

LIZ CLARKE  39:17

Yeah, they're really insightful. So yeah, social media — I'm everywhere. And KathleensPaws.org is the website.

COLLEEN  39:26

I will link all of that in the show notes.

LIZ CLARKE  39:30

My waffle. A simple question — "Where can they find you?" — and I just go off on a tangent.

COLLEEN  39:35

I think it's awesome. Different places for different people. Everybody's got a preference.

LIZ CLARKE  39:42

I really enjoyed talking to you.

COLLEEN  39:44

It was so fun talking to you today, Liz. I'm so glad you were here. And thanks for — like, seeing two dogs and deciding that that was going to be a pivot point.

LIZ CLARKE  39:55

I would never, ever have dreamt—

COLLEEN  40:02

Here's Kathleen lying upside down next to you — relaxed, safe, good life.

LIZ CLARKE  40:07

Yeah, exactly. I just hope the same for other street dogs — to have what she has as well, one day.

COLLEEN  40:16

Me too.

LIZ CLARKE  40:16

Yeah. And thank you for holding this space for people as well.

COLLEEN  40:21

It's my pleasure. I love talking to all the amazing pet pros out there. There are just so many incredible people — such a gift. So, thank you.

COLLEEN  40:34

That's our conversation for today. If something we talked about resonated, I invite you to sit with it, notice what feels true and what you want to explore further. You don't have to have it all figured out to start moving toward what matters. Whatever showed up for you today — clarity, questions, even resistance — trust that it's pointing you toward something important. For more support, join my weekly notes at ColleenPelar.com. And until next time, remember: you are enough, always, just as you are.